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Seriously getting tired of all this shilling!!!
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IversonExquisite
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 8:21 pm    Post subject: Seriously getting tired of all this shilling!!! Reply with quote

I'm getting extremely annoyed with all the shilling going on right now... it's always been a problem, but it's definately getting even more out of control as people are refusing to accept the current state of the economy and will resort to anything to make an extra buck.... and eBay has done everything they can to allow this practice, since it results in them getting more $ as well...

I just received yet another second chance offer... of course because their shill was not supposed to win... as a rule, I do not accept second chance offers... I will accept on the exception that the next bid after mine was a known purchaser and I really was just one bid away... otherwise I let the second chance offer expire and make the seller relist and wait another week to receive even less money...

A recent example...
Auction I lost and have received a second chance offer...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220337508745

The seller and buyer are both from Kentucky... and kind of funny... here's the picture from the aution I lost out on:


And here is a picture of an auction listed by the winner of the auction:


Now... it might just be that everyone in Kentucky does things the same way... but that is too similiar for me to think of anything but shilling... and eBay does list a few helpful items - like "Bid activity (%) with this seller: 75%"... c'mon...

Also - my second chance offer is for $16.03... however if the fake bidder was not included, the next highest bid before mine was for $9.99... this is another flaw with eBay's second chance offer system... if the winning bidder does not pay, then ALL their bids should be removed...

Be careful out there... I'm seeing more and more of this go on... getting tired of it...
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Celtics
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 1:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

LOL I feel ur pain but if you bid $40 on a card you should be willing to pay $40. Obviously you want to pay as little as you can but sometimes thats not the case.

Personally I wish ebay allowed shilling, back when ebay first started they let sellers bid on there own auctions which I thought was perfect then they switched this to reserve auctions which I think sucks.

Is shilling imoral? Yes and its too bad it happens on most auctions but if you bid a certain amount you should be willing to pay a certain amount.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 1:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

yeah i dont have difintive proof but there was a card i wanted for my pc and everyone knows that the only time a bid reaches BV for a card is in the waning moments if at all
well this card was near bv days before it ended, okay maybe it was a fluke. well a week later, the same card was up for auction by the same seller, now im really suspicious. low and behold the same thing happened, the card was near bv days before it ended, now i know this is bs. both auctions ended around the same price. it hasnt been quite a week since it ended so lets see if it goes up again, if it does ill post it.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 5:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Celtics wrote:
LOL I feel ur pain but if you bid $40 on a card you should be willing to pay $40. Obviously you want to pay as little as you can but sometimes thats not the case.

Personally I wish ebay allowed shilling, back when ebay first started they let sellers bid on there own auctions which I thought was perfect then they switched this to reserve auctions which I think sucks.

Is shilling imoral? Yes and its too bad it happens on most auctions but if you bid a certain amount you should be willing to pay a certain amount.


x2

don't agree with shilling be allowed tho. and the whole perpose of an auction is to get something for as good of a deal as you can. if you go to a live auction and you make a bid, and someone over-bids you and then doesn't pay...if you were the 2nd highest bidder you can get offered for the price of your offer. not what the highest offer was, that bid gets cancelled.
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Jasondr91
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 6:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I notice shilling being more rampant than ever myself. Anytime you get a second chance offer, you have to do your homework on it. I love getting them *minutes* after the auction ends. WTF?

I think shilling is more rampant on coin sales and autos than for cards in my opinion. Of course we are talking about much higher dollar amounts too.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 7:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Celtics wrote:


Personally I wish ebay allowed shilling, back when ebay first started they let sellers bid on there own auctions which I thought was perfect then they switched this to reserve auctions which I think sucks.



When selllers were allowed to shill, that was the worse for buyers, but I guess for sellers it was not.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 2:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You know shilling is out of control when a ebay member named hobbykings shills


shilled auction with brand new shilling account jvitale1998 made just for this auction
Dave DeBusschere 2000-01 UD Legendary Jerseys Autograph
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270290051409

Even leaves the shilling account jvitale1998 feedback
http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=hobbykings&ftab=FeedbackLeftForOthers
Super Fast Payment!!! Recommended to ALL!!! AAA+++ Buyer!!! Thanks Smile Buyer:
jvitale1998 ( 1 )
Nov-18-08 18:25
Dave DeBusschere 2000-01 UD Legendary Jerseys Autograph (#270290051409) -- View Item
or
http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=jvitale1998

and back for auction
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270310884263
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270327100595





Last edited by Lakers-Showtime on Tue Jan 06, 2009 8:01 pm; edited 1 time in total
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IversonExquisite
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 3:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Celtics wrote:
LOL I feel ur pain but if you bid $40 on a card you should be willing to pay $40. Obviously you want to pay as little as you can but sometimes thats not the case.


Well... if you bid $40 for a card and there is a legitimate reason to pay that much, then all's fair...

however... only a fool would actually pay that much when the true value is, say $20... you may be willing to pay $150,000 for a house... but when you find one you want and make an offer... based on all other comps in the area... you may offer $130,000 for the house... and you may get it at that... but, if there are other - legeitmate offers, you may go up to $150k to get it... but you know what your limit is and are not buying based on other "fake" bids... I'm obviously willing to pay almost $5 a gallon for gas, since it was there not too long ago... however, I'd be a fool to pay that now... since the true value is about $2 a gallon...

I get the spirit of your message - only bid what you are willing to pay for a card - but just because someone is willing to pay more doesn't mean they should do so because of fraud...
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 4:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I actually got suspended from ebay less than a year ago for shilling. It was not on purpose though. My dad thought it would be fun to bid on some of my stuff. He thought it was ok. I got suspended for 7 days. So they are doing there homework on the low dollar sellers but letting it happen on the bid dogs.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lakers-Showtime wrote:
You know shilling is out of control when a ebay member named hobbykings shills


shilled auction with brand new shilling account jvitale1998 made just for this auction
Dave DeBusschere 2000-01 UD Legendary Jerseys Autograph
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270290051409

Even leaves the shilling account jvitale1998 feedback
http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=hobbykings&ftab=FeedbackLeftForOthers
Super Fast Payment!!! Recommended to ALL!!! AAA+++ Buyer!!! Thanks Smile Buyer:
jvitale1998 ( 1 )
Nov-18-08 18:25
Dave DeBusschere 2000-01 UD Legendary Jerseys Autograph (#270290051409) -- View Item
or
http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=jvitale1998

and back for auction
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270310884263





What an alarming situation here. So, should be interesting if anything is done here. Allowing that user to use such a name, AND the HK logo in his auctions.....WOW. Anybody have any info on this one?????
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jasondr91 wrote:
Lakers-Showtime wrote:
You know shilling is out of control when a ebay member named hobbykings shills


shilled auction with brand new shilling account jvitale1998 made just for this auction
Dave DeBusschere 2000-01 UD Legendary Jerseys Autograph
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270290051409

Even leaves the shilling account jvitale1998 feedback
http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=hobbykings&ftab=FeedbackLeftForOthers
Super Fast Payment!!! Recommended to ALL!!! AAA+++ Buyer!!! Thanks Smile Buyer:
jvitale1998 ( 1 )
Nov-18-08 18:25
Dave DeBusschere 2000-01 UD Legendary Jerseys Autograph (#270290051409) -- View Item
or
http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=jvitale1998

and back for auction
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270310884263





What an alarming situation here. So, should be interesting if anything is done here. Allowing that user to use such a name, AND the HK logo in his auctions.....WOW. Anybody have any info on this one?????



I expressed concern for this very reason to the proper person about this about a month ago but was told there wasn't anything that could be done at the time. Hopefully there is now.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 5:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IversonExquisite wrote:
Celtics wrote:
LOL I feel ur pain but if you bid $40 on a card you should be willing to pay $40. Obviously you want to pay as little as you can but sometimes thats not the case.


Well... if you bid $40 for a card and there is a legitimate reason to pay that much, then all's fair...

however... only a fool would actually pay that much when the true value is, say $20... you may be willing to pay $150,000 for a house... but when you find one you want and make an offer... based on all other comps in the area... you may offer $130,000 for the house... and you may get it at that... but, if there are other - legeitmate offers, you may go up to $150k to get it... but you know what your limit is and are not buying based on other "fake" bids... I'm obviously willing to pay almost $5 a gallon for gas, since it was there not too long ago... however, I'd be a fool to pay that now... since the true value is about $2 a gallon...

I get the spirit of your message - only bid what you are willing to pay for a card - but just because someone is willing to pay more doesn't mean they should do so because of fraud...

+1
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i hate the people think they will get top dollar now for there cards, its horrible and people are idiots, im seeing superfractor rcs selling for 56 dollars for pretty decent players, that should be a sign. i laugh at those sellers and watch as they get charged still for their cards for listing them every time. the only people i feel bad for are all those collectors who bought lebron exquisite rcs for 10,000-12,000 and now selling for 5500. those people i can see listing there cards with a high BIN so they can try to get back some money on it. i think the days of making money on cards are pretty much done, now it should be about collecting and for the fun of it
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 12:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jasondr91 wrote:
Lakers-Showtime wrote:
You know shilling is out of control when a ebay member named hobbykings shills


shilled auction with brand new shilling account jvitale1998 made just for this auction
Dave DeBusschere 2000-01 UD Legendary Jerseys Autograph
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270290051409

Even leaves the shilling account jvitale1998 feedback
http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=hobbykings&ftab=FeedbackLeftForOthers
Super Fast Payment!!! Recommended to ALL!!! AAA+++ Buyer!!! Thanks Smile Buyer:
jvitale1998 ( 1 )
Nov-18-08 18:25
Dave DeBusschere 2000-01 UD Legendary Jerseys Autograph (#270290051409) -- View Item
or
http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=jvitale1998

and back for auction
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270310884263





What an alarming situation here. So, should be interesting if anything is done here. Allowing that user to use such a name, AND the HK logo in his auctions.....WOW. Anybody have any info on this one?????


That would be Giovanni aka SportItUpCards. Hmmmm I remember saying that user name would come back to bite us in the donkey and I asked him when I was on staff to change it. I warned there would be consequences. Let the **** hit the fan. I do hope the mods do something now as it is time to take action.

Oh and it's up for sale again. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270327100595&ssPageName=MERC_VIC_RCRX_Pr4_PcY_BIN_Stores_IT&refitem=270310884263&itemcount=4&refwidgetloc=closed_view_item&usedrule1=CrossSell_LogicX&refwidgettype=cross_promot_widget&_trksid=p284.m183&_trkparms=algo%3DCRX%26its%3DS%252BI%252BSS%26itu%3DISS%252BUCI%252BSI%26otn%3D4

Could there be a story behind it? I'm sure, will he tell it/will we believe it? I doubt it
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 1:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, if anyone should be complaining, I think it should be Celtics. Look what happened to him here regarding the David Robinson Exquisite patch fiasco........

Bruce, got anymore of that popcorn? Smile
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 2:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Who has ownership of the name and logo? Someone should prepare a cease and desist letter. Those examples shadow our site poorly!

Why is this post so wide? I have to scroll left/right to read it.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 5:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

fullmetal wrote:
Who has ownership of the name and logo? Someone should prepare a cease and desist letter. Those examples shadow our site poorly!

Why is this post so wide? I have to scroll left/right to read it.




*Ditto* Shocked
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 5:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey guys, he's been put on the deactivated/under investigation list. We're working on getting this sorted out, at least getting HK's name removed from it. He has been contacted, as has ebay, in the past, unfortunately neither side was willing to cooperate and apparently we didn't take it far enough with him at that time. Thanks to you detectives for posting this, I hate that this guy can involve the HK name with these scumbag activities.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 8:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you need some help with ebay, let me know. I do a fair amount of work with ebay on behalf of clients that need to protect their trademarks and prevent counterfeits. Ebay has an easy form and then a small department of lawyers that sort through this stuff. But, if you handle it right, I bet ebay would take his user name away.

Of course, I guess the bigger issue is whether someonw wants to actually do more to protect the name, such as trademark it . . .
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 8:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Has HK been trademarked to prevent this from occuring?
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 8:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the update Deek, and the suggestion gharper.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 9:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry to hear about your bad expirience
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 10:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gb234 wrote:
Has HK been trademarked to prevent this from occuring?


Even if trademarked a user ID won't really fall into that area of protection... if he used hobbykings.com as his ID then you MIGHT have something, because you have a time line established for use of that domain registry... but the bottom line is any business is solely responsible for protecting their intellectual property... and it sounds like none of the standard precautions were done.

In regard to him using the logo, you may be able to get him to stop with a $500 Nasty-Gram (a basic nasty lawyer letter)... you won't get any monetary compensation since it is difficult to bleed a turnip... but you can get him to stop.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 12:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good work Admin and Mods and thanks for the update.

Krom - Um....nice sig Laughing
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This auction ended early this morning and I couldn't believe it went as high as it did, now it makes sense as he just sent me a 2nd chance offer hours after it ended lol.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200296844138&ssPageName=ADME:X:SCO:US:1123
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